I'll fu@k her tonight, you tomorrow

[00:00:00] Hey, listener persons, I'd like to thank you for listening and making the podcast a success. And because of you, we are now monetized. But with that, we do have a shameless ask. We need you to fill out a survey that's in the show notes so we can have sponsorship that's relatable to you. They don't ask or collect any personal info, but it really helps us out. Plus, Jack and I spew enough shit on the show, we don't think you want any more unrelatable shit added on. So please click the link down in the notes below and enjoy yourself on this next episode.

[00:00:30] Where's your new assistant? Oh, she's in therapy, dude. She's always in therapy. Well, if you were for where we used to work at, you'd be in fucking therapy all the time, too. Oh, she's all kinds of fucked up. Yep. Sprechen wir doch mal über deinen Traumtyp. Oh, schwierig. Schieß los. Okay, er muss für jedes Abenteuer zu haben sein und natürlich toll aussehen. Und er darf mich nie lang warten lassen.

[00:00:58] Klingt verdächtig nach dem neuen Ford Puma Gen E. Der lädt schneller als dein Smartphone. Von 10 auf 80 Prozent in nur 23 Minuten. Hm. Dann muss ich wohl mal... Probefahren! Der neue Ford Puma Gen E. Jetzt Probefahrt buchen auf ford.de. I'm Jason and that's Jack. He stutters, I don't. But I'm massively dyslexic.

[00:01:26] Both of us are hairdressers with years of stories to tell. And this is shit I told my hairdresser. Hello and welcome back to another episode of Some More Shit with Jack and Jason. Jack, how are you? I'm okay. How's it going? Good. Less jet lag now? Yeah. Yeah. I've slept it all off. I'm normal again. Sort of.

[00:01:54] Well, you look less like shit, so. Thanks. That's good. So, we have some friends with us today. We actually have someone that I've known for, let's say, over 20 years now. His name is John and his wife, Lauren. They're both hairdressers down in Orange County in the OC. John and I started off a Tonian guy years ago, the California side. And we kind of grew up together in this hairdressing industry.

[00:02:20] And John has definitely taken a career path different than mine, but still in education. So, welcome guys. Welcome John. Welcome Lauren. Thanks for being here with us. Appreciate it. I'm glad to be here. Yeah. Why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself? Well, thank you. No, it's good to see you both. I mean, last time when we really seriously hung out, I was back at the company back in the day. And I was like 17 years old. So, I just kind of got started around that time. 1999. I joined Tonian Guy as a business apprentice. Yeah.

[00:02:47] And you were already a senior art director by that time. I was a big piece of shit. Yeah. So, I started there. I worked there about. Four or five years. And then, yeah, I had some really good times when that was still swinging. And so, I did place to be. Got really into all the educational side of the industry. Really loved teaching classes. I always wanted to be one of the rock stars like you guys on stages and doing photography and editorial hair and all that stuff. So, I got super inspired working there.

[00:03:16] But it kind of ran its course. You know, the corporate thing kind of runs its course for everybody, I think, in different situations. And there was a lot of wild times that were crammed into it. That four or five years in there. But, you know, I started modeling a little bit at the time. I don't remember that. That kind of started pushing me in different directions. So, I started being really even more into doing it. I do remember that. Yeah. That was a bit of a foray into more editorial work and stuff like that. But I eventually just quit working for the company and I went to work for a salon owner

[00:03:45] here at Costa Mesa. I was a regular, like mom and mom at the salon. And they were one of the first people to use this big European product line that was kind of new at the time. And probably within a year of working there, I got an opportunity to be like a wild card on their international competition stage. And I walked on and won. It was the first year that they were doing this competition. So, I walked on and won. And then that launched me into like, opened a door anyway to like being the visionary artist.

[00:04:13] And I met a good friend at the time for a long time, this guy named Joe. And we ran an independent education business. So, the time it glommed on to that company as like in the distributor as a way of like offering independent education. So, that was called The Network. Yeah. We ran The Network for like 10 years, trying our best to offer workshops and videos and demonstrations and stuff like that from an independent one. Yeah. I walked in on one actually. It was in Southern California. I kind of like bombarded one of your classes. Yeah. Or maybe that was when I was teaching for the distributor.

[00:04:42] I don't remember which class that was for. But it was all kind of wrapped together anyway. Like The Network and The Distributor and the company were. Right. Yeah. So, yeah. I did that. I was working in the salon and teaching and traveling. I'm doing all the hair shows. I'm working for magazines. You know, doing like a low-level editorial stuff, honestly. I wasn't never really like launched into doing hair. My modeling career had to be more in vogue than my hair career did. Yeah. Working with really famous people or whatever.

[00:05:10] I remember because you really had that look back then. You know what I mean? That was like everyone wanted. So, and that really pissed off, I think, some of the creative directors with the company we worked with. Because they were like, hey, you got to pick. It's either us or you're doing this. You know, one or the other. Yeah. And they were really hoping that you would choose us, but you didn't. Yeah. I mean, I think I saw it. I did get an ultimatum from one of the big bosses when I was working there. I was like, hey, you either can be a model or you can be a hairdresser. They like to do that.

[00:05:38] The big meeting where you have to cry and bang for like a vacation with your family. Yeah. I've done all my vacation requests properly and it came down to like us or them. And I was already like working overtime for free and doing lots of stuff that I felt like it was, you know, going above and beyond. And so it didn't sit right to be good at ultimatum. That was kind of like the exit door for me. But I and I said I was going to quit doing hair and go. Good riddance, I think. But I didn't actually quit doing hair.

[00:06:05] I went to work in a salon up here in Orange Cabin, Costa Mesa and started just trying to launch out in the independent education by it. And I did so many hair shows. Like, I don't know how many, you know, like how it can be back when hair shows were a thing. You know, it was like three or four a year. You know, you go from Vegas to Orlando to Chicago, maybe to Seattle. And do that certain bit. So I did that and worked in the salon. Got married to a receptionist that from telling me a guy when I like shortly. Oh, that I was dating when I left. I had a couple of kids.

[00:06:35] And then like, that's usually what happens. It's so incestuous. You know what I mean? That's usually what happens. And I'm married to a hairdresser. Yeah, no, I'm married to a hairdresser. I'm different. Things free. Well, that's why I had to have you on, Lauren. You know what I mean? It was like, you know, I find out that John's married to a hairdresser. I'm like, oh, no, no, we're having these guys on. Didn't know that? Exactly. Yeah. So then, yeah, COVID. I think by the time COVID had rolled around and I'd already left. I'd kind of worked at a few salons because I know you always look behind you.

[00:07:04] I don't know if this happened to you guys, but you kind of feel like you're working in the same place forever. And then you look behind you and you're like, oh, crap. I've actually worked at like that salon. Did you guys have trouble leaving the cult too? Was it hard? No, I was fired. I had it super easy. It was like, get the fuck out. Me too. But I mean, if you're a convert or like, I don't know. I've always like trying to find that kind of familial life thing and it's hard to find again. I always felt like a loner after that. You went into a different.

[00:07:32] I don't because I actually, my path like complete change. I mean, we both worked in LA. We're doing like really exciting stuff. And, you know, so, but now I'm just kind of, I'm more comfortable with where I'm at, with who I am as well as you. I'm glad I went through all the shit that I went through and I'm glad I went to LA because LA definitely is where I cut my teeth. That's for sure. You know? And so now it's just kind of like, I can just kind of coast and make great fucking money doing it, you know, because you've been doing it for so long. You know?

[00:08:00] So as far as like being away from all that, I fucking love it. I was happy to leave actually. And to be in Hollywood in the nineties was amazing. I thought, so I was really happy to go. It was hard to leave that. Teenage years and the first thing that I really knew in the industry. And it really, when you're at the company, then you could feel like one of those, any of those companies probably, you feel like kind of insular, like there's nothing out there. It's a desert. Like don't leave the castle walls because you're going to die.

[00:08:28] And so when you leave, you kind of have, I don't know, I had to go through kind of waves of emotion. There was a lot that I wasn't immediately involved in, but then there was a lot that I was missing. And there was like this awkwardness, kind of like leaving a church. Like, are these still my friends? Can I still express, you know, still talk to people or whatever? You can't talk to your old coworker that they still work there, right? Some of them, I think so. Oh yeah. They were told that. In fact. It's a cult. Hold on cult. One of the guys that worked at the salon actually lived at my, lived in my house when I was fired.

[00:08:57] And the owners walked over to him and said, you can't say a word. You will fire you. The social engineering was a... And that's exactly, no, that's exactly how they would go through and approach things. You know? So that's why when I, when I got fired, I was like, I was a bit pissed off. But the exact same time, like looking back at my, it's the best thing that ever happened to me. It was letting me go, especially at that time. Because I was so young enough to go through work. Yeah. You thought your world was broken at the beginning, you know what I mean? But then literally it took like about a week or two. And I was like, oh, I'm good. I'm free.

[00:09:26] I'm actually making more money somewhere else. Yeah. You know, and you start realizing how much money they were taking off of you. Yeah. I wouldn't. You know? So that way it's like, ah, now I'm making my own money and I'm fucking great. I don't need you. You don't need these big fucking companies anymore. People think like I need to be part of something. I, you know what, let me, let me get that right. Let me re-say, let me re-say that. It's always good to be part of something, part of a community. That's the good part.

[00:09:53] It's just when it's a toxic community, like some of the companies that we work for, that's the bad part of it. Especially when they- We have to question it, I don't think. Well, and let me say this. Right. I think these companies actually learn over time to exploit that fact that everybody wants to be part of something. And like, there might even be a good intention in the beginning to create a cool team or like a family. But, you know, when you have thousands of people that all have their own minds and want to do stuff, it's not long before like it gets bent into kind of a controlling kind of thing, a cultish kind of thing.

[00:10:22] Yeah, it always goes, oh. It really does. And that's exactly what happened to me as well. The reason I got fired was because the owner got divorced and I was still friends with his wife who was working in LA. Oh, the AT. And they didn't want me doing stuff with her, right? So that was like, well, we'll teach you a lesson. We'll teach anybody else a lesson as well, though, too. We're going to fire Jason and make him an example so that no one will leave us. Because he was like, I was one of the top guys there.

[00:10:51] Yeah, it makes everybody behave when you get fired like that. Exactly. So it was just like, let's keep everyone in line. We'll fire the top guy. Jason, you're fucking out of here. And then everyone will fall in line. Well, that only happened for a short period of time. And then everyone started to fucking jump ship at that point. Well, and so it's funny. It's like the derivative stuff, too, where people go second generation and take the cult onto independent salons. And that's what happened to Lauren. I got sucked into like the cult number two, cult number three.

[00:11:18] She ended up working for somebody who was an owner in the company and ended up out just like everybody else. And now is trying to cultivate their own local branch of it. Yeah. It's like, it worked for them. I'm going to follow that, you know, and I'm going to go through and do my whole thing. Well, it's Ghost Town. Now that salon has only got the owners because nobody wants to be part of that culture anymore. It's so dead. Oh, I love that. Oh, wow. I had no idea. And I still know someone that goes there to get their hair cut.

[00:11:47] So I'm going to get a scoop on that even further. They just lost their last 20 year veterans. So they're officially solo. Wow. I love that. That's great. Good news. The new generation is not having it. Yeah, they would never tolerate what we went through. And I'm glad, you know what I mean? People don't really realize that you have to evolve and this industry has to evolve, you know, and if you don't evolve with it, you're going to fucking lose everything. And I'm glad I'm actually kind of watching it happen. So Lauren, tell us a little bit about yourself.

[00:12:16] I got started at like 17 in beauty school, doing high school, dating an older guy that was working at a beautiful salon in Newport where some people got their start. And so I started in Newport and then I was an assistant just during training during beauty school. And I was kind of like learning that I wanted to live and work in Newport. So I tried to work at, gosh, I worked at, we're not saying names. I went to Gregory's.

[00:12:44] I went to Gregory's for a long time. There's a lot of people. That's fine. How many people? That's a big shop. That's a big shop. It was down the road from us. I'm from like a big shop like Gregory's. It was like a big transition for me. I hadn't been exposed to like three stories of it. Yeah, it's like three stories of like a hundred chairs. Yes. For people that don't know. But I wanted to work for one man. And I worked very hard above my boyfriend at the time to get that job. And I was very excited to get that job and work for him for a while.

[00:13:14] I had a really good experience. I had great mentors. And then oddly had a similar breakup like you of being demoted. And I went to work for for a while and did that whole done thing. And it was fun. I was there for like 17 years. Like I absolutely loved it. I just recently left like during COVID. So I kind of had like an intercede. Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's recent. Yeah. You're glutton for punishment. You're like, yes, keep hitting me. Keep hitting me. Yes. So I'm fresh.

[00:13:43] Like I'm freshly out of all of this. Oh, good. All right. So yeah. So you're welcome. That's Christian. Yeah. You're still in the Christian guilt mode. Yeah. I feel like a lot. Oh, yeah. I do feel. I feel it. But it's nice. It's fun. I work in a community of people like us where there's an understanding for the culture and more like a friendship vibe like this. It's not competitive at all. Yeah. The new salon. Yeah. And the new salon I'm working at. So it's interesting to look back at all of this and then have John and other people

[00:14:09] have their experiences to validate that what I went through was real, you know? Absolutely. And the funny thing of it is that one of the guys that you worked for, we actually did an episode about, and I'm pretty sure it's called Narcissist. So if you guys go back and listen to that episode, this is the person in that episode we're talking about Lauren used to work for. So he's definitely an interesting character. But the odd thing of it, though. I loved it.

[00:14:38] Like, I had such an amazing experience because I was 17 years old. So he was like a father figure to me. He made sure that nobody picked on me. And he really spent a lot of time trying to teach you to be his assistant, which I've never gotten that kind of attention before. We call that grooming. I loved it. Okay. I'm happy. I love you guys nip all these times. I loved it. Like, I felt like he really prepared me for a career in a weird way. Not everybody has been groomed like that.

[00:15:07] Post-traumatic. Post-traumatic. So my Stockholm syndrome is, like, really high. No, it's post-traumatic. Right, yeah. When I say the Christian guilt is still there, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah. No, I have to admit as well, the two, I'm very glad I went through everything that I went through. I've learned a lot. And I'll tell you the truth. I probably would do it all over again the exact same way. Because it's definitely shaped me as the hairdresser that I am. But I'm also glad that my journey took me to other places so I could learn and grow in different ways as well, the two.

[00:15:35] I don't know how I'm having that kind of ego and this kind of attitude, like, in a different time. Like, it just seems so, like, I wouldn't ever be able to, I would never want to act like how some of these people act or they run their shows. But it was interesting at the time how successful some of these people in some of these places were. But that was the 90s in the early, in the 2000s. And now with the Me Too movement, that's all over with. You can't go through the run of this that way. The Me Too movement. Remember, like. It's done.

[00:16:02] How many guys got into the hairdressing because they saw Warren Beatty being, you know, being a player and shampoo. And I feel like almost all the guys that I was looking up to in the 90s and the early 2000s who were already established got into it in the 80s and the late 70s because of that kind of thing. And then that carried for a while and actually started to create kind of a lot of rock star kind of idolized dudes in the industry who were, you know, had the swagger, who wanted the name on the building and who were starting to kind of establish kind of a team of minions

[00:16:30] and, you know, yeah, like that. And they'll address a vibe. I think it's just, it's not like that anymore. You know, it's like not a. No, no. Yeah. You can't like, you know, force your teenage clients to go through and like hug and kiss you anymore. They walk through the door. Yeah. You don't have your assistant on your lap in the break room, you know. That was part of your guys' dream. Oh. Oh, we did that too. Yeah. How old are you? 17? Oh, yeah. You got to get up. That was pretty much how it was.

[00:16:59] Sexual harassment was just part of the fun you were having, I guess. You just have to know how to duck and dodge it and not commit it. Especially the Italian companies. You know what I mean? It's those Italian guys. Oh, my God. Let me tell you. Some of them, I remember because Tony and Guy, they were Italian and they would bring a lot of the Italian hairdressers over. And some of them, I was like, holy shit. I'm like, how do you guys get away? We couldn't do that in the United States. But you go to London, you know what I mean? And they were all over these girls.

[00:17:29] And I'm like, I mean, this is like, seriously. I'm like, you can get fired for this shit. That's nearly. You nearly raped them in front of everybody. And then you went. You know? It's like, what are you doing? Trying to find the ugly so they don't touch them. Only girls can. Yeah. I mean, it's just crazy, you know? But over there, even the girls are like, oh, Antonio, knock it off. You just stop it. You know? And they kind of blow them off and push them back. And yeah. So. Yeah. I worked for the big company that I kind of got into when I left, Tony and Guy. You know, I was Italian. And there was a lot of that going.

[00:17:59] When it starts off and it's like a small company, you know, there's like a little bit more. I don't know. There's not as much HR kind of eyeballs on things, I guess. And so. And back in the day when it was just in a few countries and it hadn't really taken off. But for like the longest time, there was this one guy that was the vice president of North America. And I call him Pepe Lequeux now because he just has. I mean, it's kind of a French name, but he had an alliterated Italian name. So. So. But that was the MO.

[00:18:26] And it was like, you couldn't believe what you were seeing sometimes or the things that he would just forward, you know, just forwardly say, like right to people's faces while everybody could be as though it's like how it's done there. I don't know. I never lived in Italy, but I don't know if you can just ask a girl, like boyfriend, if I can fuck her now and you can fuck her later or that kind of thing. Jeez. That sounds about that. Yeah. We've been. Jack and I have been in Italy together and it's like, it's crazy.

[00:18:56] And we're back. All right. So the real reason now that I know you guys that we have you guys here is to go through and get to some story time about some of the shit you guys have heard and seen. We're talking a little bit about the Italian companies that we work for and some of that. And I know that the story goes way deeper with you, John. And so you've seen some definite shit with some of the people that you've worked with, as I have as well, too.

[00:19:24] So we actually talked about the boss that we used to work for in a previous episode. I don't remember which one it was. I think about cheating or something like that. So you work for an Italian company. Yeah. And let's tell us a little bit about your experience. Just like one story out because there's so many things that, you know, happen and with these in this world and you start to think, like, was that a story I tell or was that just fun? We were having it or is that like a bad thing that happened or so certain ones pop out though.

[00:19:53] And like when people get injured or when, you know, people have to go to the hospital afterwards for too much. You have to be called. Yeah. When the party's over, you know, that's really pretty good. So. Well, no, no good story started with off with eating a salad. So, you know what I mean? Usually starts with the consumption of some alcohol, you know, which is what was going on. We were at an after party. So we put on, you know, the visionary artists for these companies have like their, not only do they go around and tour at the big hair shows, but they'll have like soirees and like smaller in company insular hair shows.

[00:20:23] So the company was throwing one of those in Boston. I was there on stage working with the big shot, you know, global creative director. And then also who was there, who was always there is the DT of North America. It was company. Yeah. And so I'm, we've broken down the show and in the same venue where like the party just gets started. The bars go on, the DJs play in, there's like dance floor happening now. And I'm finally getting to relax. And this girl comes over to me and like out of the blue and kind of attaches herself to me. Like, you know, and I didn't really know what was going on.

[00:20:53] So I felt like, oh, she saw me on stage and you know, she thinks that I'm cool. And we're going to. But it was, it became clear after not too long that she was kind of looking for like some sort of body shield or like a human shield or something like a diversion or a distraction because the VP was on the, on the case. Like he was, had decided that this chick, she had a few drinks. I could tell she was a little tipsy and she was like, he had his crosshairs on her. And so we go, you know, we're trying to keep away around different parts of the bar.

[00:21:22] And then we ended up going over to get another drink and he just like comes right over to the bar. And at this point. Now, let me ask you a question. How old is the VP? Oh, at this time, I mean, this was probably in 2007 or so, I guess, or 10. So this 15 years ago, he was probably in his mid forties and she was probably in her twenties and I was in my twenties. Yep. Exactly. That's usually. And you want to, let's add another, like, he's probably almost closer to 50 and probably married a couple of kids. You know what I mean?

[00:21:52] Who are not there in Boston. And probably. Yeah. And he's probably got like family in the North dimension. Yeah. So he comes over to the bar and it's like, it starts to get like really clear, like why she's so worried about this. Cause he's like very forward, you know? And he catches on that. She's like trying to be with me now. Yeah. I'm with this guy. And so he just starts talking to me directly with her standing right next to me. And he's like going on about how he's leaving town tomorrow early in the morning. And I'm not leaving. He knows the schedule of our team and not when we're taking off instead.

[00:22:22] So I'll be there another day. And so he just says right in front of her, like, why don't I fuck her tonight and you fuck her tomorrow? I'm like, why not? That's just how you negotiate these things. Right? Yeah. What a deal. Yeah. So, I mean, while I was still trying to process like what was even going on, she like offended as you would be. Right? She goes to kick at him, like throw her leg at him, like throw a front kick straight at his crotch or his stomach or whatever. That's when things got really bad because she slipped.

[00:22:49] There must've been a drink drop right at the, where we were scanning at the bar that we hadn't really, I didn't really don't wear it. But just so you know, she's slipping, falling flat on her ass and she's wearing a little skirt and there was groping glass down there on the ground. And like the party was like, you'd mentioned like the record skipping. The party is over, dude. Lush. Oh, right. Yeah. Lush. So like the, you know, the elder women and better kind of around the company and stuff kind of swoop in and pick her up and like, you know, are you okay? And they kind of take her off. And I'm just like, kind of bewildered.

[00:23:20] BP dude is just like, you know, whatever. Off to like the next thing. And so no one got, no one got to fuck her. Nobody got even at the fuck. Oh God. Yeah. Missed opportunity. Yeah. So as we're in the night, it wasn't even over yet. But as we're getting like carted off to the, you know, out the door, everybody's kind of making their way out the door of this place. And they're taking her. And when we're finding out, they're going to take her to the emergency room. That's a problem. It was open at that point.

[00:23:49] And I'm going to get back to get a ride in the hotel. And here comes the creative director. It's not even the VP. But now it's like the big guy who I work for. Let's talk about your dream type. Oh, it's hard. Let's go. Okay. He has to be for every adventure. And of course, he has to be great. And he doesn't let me wait for a long time. It sounds like a bad thing after the new Ford Puma Gen E. He's faster than your smartphone. From 10 to 80% in only 23 minutes. Hmm.

[00:24:20] Then I have to go. Probe on. The new Ford Puma Gen E. Now book a test. Probe on. Probe on. Probe on. Probe on. Probe on. Probe on. Probe on. Probe on.

[00:25:01] Who comes over to. And he was just sloshed drugged at this time. And dude grabs onto my belt loops of my pants. And like falls on the ground trying to pull my pants off. Like as his last effort to like try to have some fun. And people are like. Oh my God. It was just pandemonium at this club. And so we. Anyone hugged me? I got away. We go back. I get back to the hotel. Which he'll do. Which he'll do. Probably 20 minute drive away. And I didn't have to share a ride with him. But we were staying in the same place.

[00:25:30] And the tour manager tells me afterwards the next morning over coffee that the creative director had told the head colorist that she wasn't allowed in the car because she was too ugly to ride back to the hotel. And bring out one. Jeez. That sounds about right. That sounds like the 2000s. You know what I mean? It was like. Seeing that refus like a little bit. No. I'm not going to lie. You could get away with quite a bit. And you know. So VP. As far as I know.

[00:26:00] He might still be the VP of this company. I don't think. I've been involved in a little while. But no major consequences in that situation for him. I could tell you another story. About that guy. Oh I definitely want to hear another story about that guy. Absolutely. Yeah. So I had another show. We were doing a big global conference for the company. And we were in Italy for this one. So in his home turf basically. And we. I was with the salon. I was working with. That's when it's worse. Was that? So it's worse. That's when it's worse. Yeah.

[00:26:30] Right. When they're at home. And they're comfortable. And you would know what the fuck they want. Well and it seems like he had like. Even like the cab driver in town. I was able to help him. You know in this situation. Oh. Because they don't talk to each other. I don't know. So he. I was out with my salon owners at the time. So this is after I left Tony and Guy. Working with the. Like the mom and pop salon. So I'm out with mom and pop. Basically. And another colleague of mine. And we ran into the VP. While we're out bar hopping. After like some of the festivities of the conference. Earlier in the day.

[00:27:00] And it was like. You know. End of the night kind of thing. And we end up. I'm needing to get a cab ride back to the hotel. Where he was staying to. And so he kind of invites himself along. For the cab ride. And the owner that I used to work for. The lady had been with the company already. Like since one of the. She was like one of the first users. So she was really. Kind of knew this guy. Knew people in the. Like in the executive team. Of the company Fridwell. So almost like friends. You know. Like all real friends. So we'll take a cab together. And so. But since there's an extra colleague with us.

[00:27:28] And cabs usually have like three people across the back. And you fit one extra person in the front. We have one extra person. But the VP was able to talk to a cab driver. And be like. You know. It's in Florence, Italy. It was middle of the night. You know. There's nobody on the streets. The guy's like. Okay. So he convinces him to put a lady on his lat. Let's. The VP sit in the front with a lady on his lat. And so now. Sure. Yeah. So now we're rolling down the street. With this scenario. This clown car. We're rolling down the street. In Italy. Drunken hairdressers.

[00:27:58] Pepe Lefue. The VP here. And he's got his. Literally has this. This lady in her club. In his clutches. You know. He's like. You know. Before you know it. The hands are around the ways. And her husband. Mind you. Was sitting next to me. In the back seat of the cab. With like a very. Wow. It's more fun that way. And. Yeah. Now he's his. Her human seat belt. So he's like. I got you. And it just makes me wonderful. Like this is a cultural thing. You know. Where. Because he didn't seem to be bothered. By the back. The husband was back there. And he's like. Nustling up in her neck. He's like. Nibbling on her ear.

[00:28:28] He's got his arms around her. I'm not sure what his hands were doing. You know. Or whatever. Well. Yeah. But. Yeah. The husband had to. You know. My friend. The husband had to speak up. Eventually. And you know. He's just. I'm not like. Hey. Hey. You know. I put an end to it. And it's like. The ride was kind of coming. So. Everybody turned away. Shake it out. All right. And you know. Just fucking around. No big deal. Let's not make it too awkward at the beginning. Let's wait towards the end. To make it awkward. And then. You know. We don't know. We're going to. Just to get. You know. That's not happening. So. For a while. It really just created. The ride wasn't that long. And so.

[00:28:58] I think it just. He started to dawn on him. As he kind of arrived there. What was really going on. But you know. For years afterwards. That was like. A major issue. And where there was this tight. Connection between a salon. And a product line. Now there's a. Husband who's like. Not very happy. With the product line. And the whole thing just. You know. That turned into perpetual. Kind of low gray drama. For a long time. But it never blew up. And again. Our VP. Our Italian VP. Always seemed to prevail. Live to. Yeah. Live to fight another day. That's the Italians. You know what I mean. They're still. But yeah. It's so funny. And those are just.

[00:29:28] One guy stories. But I really. You know. There's all these different. Others. They pop up all the time. Like mushrooms in this. In that old hair show game. Absolutely. Well he's a lovely guy. Yeah. You know. He's super nice to everybody. But it was just such like. A different world. You know. Like now. That seems like. You know. What the cops are going to be called. Back then. It seemed like. Oh. You know. Oh you. That guy. Did you. Yeah. Did you get a little kiss. You got a little kiss before you got fucked. Right. So there you go. Oh. He should be happy. You know. Wow. You like her.

[00:29:58] All right. So now we got to switch over to Lauren. Now we got to. Get some other dirt. On the female side of it. We got to hear. Because this is. It's like. It's a little boys club here. You know. I mean. We're always trying to talk about this stuff. Well you guys. Watch what happened to us. I would say. You guys know. Know more. And they keep you guys in the dark. But then feel like. If they use you guys. To make us feel all comfortable. Like wow. Like there's all these younger guys. And this older guy. This dynamic works. Right. And then. Lo and behold. You kind of figure out. Everybody's a grunt.

[00:30:28] For the main guy. And that you're. You're the one getting suffered. Oh totally. Grooming. Yeah. Yeah. And then. It's grooming. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. I can talk about this very openly. We've also. Were afraid of getting fired. As well though too. So it's kind of like. You know. Above our heads. We were just trying to look cool. And be in the moment. You know. So. No that's very. That's very true. You know. And. And that was the thing. It's like. Hey. If you want to get picked. To you know. Get tapped on the shoulder. To be on the show.

[00:30:58] Or. I was fighting. You know. To get recognized. I mean. I wanted to just sit. In a specific chair in the salon. And I'm busting my butt. It was hilarious. Oh yeah. No. But we had to keep the secrets. That's for sure. Because I definitely kept a lot of secrets. From a lot of guys. And we do talk about it. Doing the show. Really? You know. Oh. Oh hell yeah. We expose. We don't mention the names. Most of the time. But we expose a lot of hairdressers. On this show. Kind of what happens. Behind the scenes. So. And then you wouldn't get in trouble. What was that?

[00:31:27] I said you shouldn't behave like this. And then people won't tell stories. Well. Then we wouldn't have a show. So. It's already happened. You know. Exactly. It's too late. So let's hear. Let's hear from you Lauren. We did travel a lot. We did do LA. And it was very different. Like. It didn't have like that feeling of like other people. Because I just exclusively worked with. So. I had a blast during that.

[00:31:56] I don't feel like it really got. And like complicated. As far as like interpersonal. Until I worked for like. It wasn't Tony Guy. Because it was just. Derivative. Yeah. It was derivative. So. It was hard. Right. To stand that at the age. Because I actually left. Because I wanted all this structure. And I wanted something that wasn't so. One man show. So. Interesting. I think when I found out. That it was kind of an offshoot cult. I. I didn't expect that. From one one man show. Into another cult. Yeah.

[00:32:25] Because there was. Pretty much. At the cult. It felt safer. If that makes sense. Yeah. Because if everyone's doing it. So then why would you have any fear? Well. And people were driving from like. All walks of life. To work at this place. Still it still had a theme vibe. Is the white outfits. So. It was still really exciting. To work there. And they did give you a ton of education. And we made super good friends. You know. It was. It was an incredible social time. On top of like. A time for education. I wouldn't. Right. I wouldn't take any of it back. But there was a dark side. To getting models.

[00:32:55] There was a dark side. To being a model. You know. I was basically helping. You know. Groom other girls. To feel safe. In this environment. Just as much as you guys. So. To hear about this. Oh yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. I'm making the other girls feel even safer. Because I'm a hairdresser. Hanging around. And I'm female. So it must be safe. And they were not safe. No. Not at all. Those models. By the time you've reached a status. That means that you. Like you're not. You're too old. To be picked on anymore.

[00:33:25] So there's like. Two subsections. You know. Like the girl that haven't figured it out. And then the girls that have figured it out. So you kind of want to jump. To the figured it out spot. If you're going to stay and cut hair. In a salon like that. Oh hell yeah. And you can't really say anything either. Like you just kind of have to watch. The other girls come in. And be like. Oh my gosh. Everything's so great here. And like. Oh you just wait. You just wait. Yeah. See how long he lasts. How big is your skin darling. Okay. Like. You know. And we had female people. That worked with us. That had been through. You know.

[00:33:54] Some of these situations themselves. That would get drunk. And tell us the. The real stories. Of how they got brought up. And it was far worse than. The new people. Wow. Okay. So. So when you worked for this guy. What were some of the tactics. That they would use. I know a lot of it was like. Going to beauty schools. And finding young girls. And kind of grooming up that way. Or you'd work on a photo shoot. After hours. You know. We'd close up the salon. And like. Get a model mayhem. You know.

[00:34:23] Victim for him. And then. You can only imagine. You know what I noticed. Working my. All the way through my career. Is how much like. Bras or shirts all together. Don't have a lot of place. In hair photography. Photo shoots. This was a thing. Especially when guys. Yeah. It's branch art. And it all makes sense now. Like when you go back. You're like. Oh yeah. Let's fashion. That bra is not actually working. We're going to need to. Need to get rid of that. You know. Let's put you in this. Like spaghetti strap top. Like there was lots of like that. Everything that was being styled. From the upper body. Seemed to be focused. And I always thought it was. Right. But distractions from the hair.

[00:34:52] And everybody was a photographer. As well. Like the hairdresser suddenly. That was another tactic. That really. It became a good way. Of like kind of. Baiting. Getting girls to hit on. You know. It was like. Not just about art. It was about like. Yeah. I make pictures. But. Or we would make a. Right. Especially even using her for a class. You know. She had no idea. But none of us care. And just cut her hair in front of us. For the day. And like. Look like a big star. Right. But then also. When the photo shoots. Kind of kicked in. Then also the alcohol kicked in. There was some drink. So then all of a sudden.

[00:35:22] Booze would start. Booze would start. Coming into the picture. And then. Inhibitions got lowered. Pokes lined up in the office. Yeah. See that's what's so unusual. About my story. Is I actually worked. At a treatment center. For a time. And I was extremely sober. So everyone was extremely hidden with me. About that. I got excluded from a lot of like. The insider parties. Because of that. And I think. I kind of started to like. Be the more authoritarian person in the salon. That no one wanted to work there.

[00:35:51] Because I was. Kind of sick of it. I mean. There was people literally drinking. After drinking all night. In the morning. To try to get the DTs off. You know. Yeah. Yeah. And that scared the. Out of me. When I was like. 19. One of the ladies. I assisted for. Back in the day. When I was just a kid. Told me that. When she was an assistant. The bathroom. Would have lines of coke. On the sink. And they kept a fifth of vodka. In the toilet tank. Yeah. In the toilet. And it's like. Whoa. What a rapid change. And that. Because even by the time. I mean.

[00:36:21] Obviously. We weren't drinking at the corporate jobs. But I did work at. Salons. That. Where it was very much. Like a. Open boozy situation. And of course. That's always like lubrication. When it comes to the. The seedier side. Of socializing. But there was more intricate. Like parties. And things that I didn't get to be a part of. That I. I know of. Because. We're a family. Actually. To service. One of these gentlemen's fish tanks. So. It actually. I have even more. Like insight. From like the generation before us. Is how this went down. Some of the derivative.

[00:36:51] Yes. What happened? What did you. What did they tell you? You do not want to go to any one of these people's houses. Like I'll tell you that. Right. Yeah. It's just. It's not. You do not want to see the wine cellar. You know. Sounds like. Does he have a bunch of. Wow. Baby oil. Yeah. It's like. No. I'm serious. I wish it wasn't like that. But it's definitely like that. Sprechen wir doch mal über deinen Traumtyp. Oh. Schwierig. Schieß los. Okay. Er muss für jedes Abenteuer zu haben sein.

[00:37:21] Und natürlich toll aussehen. Und er darf mich nie lang warten lassen. Klingt verdächtig nach dem neuen Ford Puma Gen E. Der lädt schneller als dein Smartphone. Von 10 auf 80 Prozent in nur 23 Minuten. Hm. Dann muss ich wohl mal. Probefahren. Der neue Ford Puma Gen E. Jetzt Probefahrt buchen auf Ford.de. Auf booking.com buchst du dein Ferienhaus ganz einfach. Und dank kostenloser Stornierung passiert das hier nicht mehr. Wird das gebucht, Leute? Oh.

[00:37:51] Mark und Tim kommen jetzt. Bei booking.com kannst du kostenlos stornieren. Oh. So einfach. So geht's problemlos von zu Hause ins Ferienhaus. Hab eine größere Unterkunft gebucht. Auf booking.com findest du dein Ferienhaus ganz einfach. Und einfach entspannen. Booking.com. Booking.yeah. Überprüfe vor der Buchung die Stornierungsrichtlinie der Unterkunft. It's a Dibby party, man. Yeah. Very Dibby party. Wow.

[00:38:19] And see, that's the thing about the hairdressing industry people don't know about. It's like a lot of people, they make like really good money, really fast. A lot of young kids in the industry. Because we were young and we were very impressionable at that time. And we just thought it was normal. Totally. Because you didn't know. It is similar to being in the music industry like that. Because you want to be somebody. You want to like hang out with people that have seen like they're very accomplished. So you keep your mouth shut though. Like all of us did, obviously. Or we wouldn't have thought so far. And it's true. We did keep our mouth. I kept my mouth shut.

[00:38:46] Because a lot of the VPs, I was the one showing up every single morning. Because I wasn't the one there until four in the morning doing coke. And doing whatever to like little girls. You know what I mean? I was like actually sleeping a little. You know what I mean? But then I was always the first one there at 6 a.m. to start doing the hair. So they always counted on me. But then I wouldn't say anything to the wives either. All of the ex-girlfriends from the past would have like a, I would say like a month cooling off period. Before they started showing back up at the photo shoots and the songs.

[00:39:16] To try to tell us what he had done to them. Like we're talking like, oh my god, you have to know. Like you have to know. Help me. And we're like, sorry. I mean, I'm sorry. I mean, that sounds like a you guys problem. This is a photo shoot. So bye. Oh wow. Yeah. Yeah. Because a lot of those photo shoots towards the end, they kept the model there. Everyone kind of went home. Hey, we're wrapping up now. You can go ahead and take it off. We don't need you anymore.

[00:39:45] The next thing you know, there's like maybe two or three people left at the end. And that's when shit really does happen. A woman that these people dated for long term coming back feeling like they needed to tell us about the trauma. You know, like, hey, I accused in front of you. Didn't you guys see all this? Don't you know how he is? And we're like, no, darling. You're just a, you're just a number. Like go back. You know, so I do feel bad. Like I, well, I even did his ex-wife's hair for a number of years after a marriage.

[00:40:13] And I mean, I would be in hell if I shared the things that I was told about these people in even more intimate conditions. It's not okay. Wow. There you go. Trauma happening all over. Yeah. But see, it's hard on you guys too. It's not just women that got traumatized. I don't think this was fun for a little voice to have to grow up. I definitely got. I mean, I never got, and nobody ever like got me all the way or anything, but I definitely got hands on me and, you know, at dances and cornered. And like I mentioned, somebody trying to pull my pants off.

[00:40:42] And like, so, you know, they're definitely, the gay guys were doing it to the dudes and the straight men were doing it to the girls. It was the 90s. And I remember coming up as an assistant. I already, that was trajectory of mine. I was going to be a photographer, art director. I was going to be just Lothario having stories to tell about all the models that I, you know, was looking up with and stuff. And then I just ended up getting married and like having kids instead of it. And then, you know. But when you're a young guy, I think that this is like the entertainment industry. You know, it seems so much like that for sure. And I think there's so much crossover in the entertainment industry with us.

[00:41:12] And we're artists and we get a lot of cloud and we make some money. And we end up with a lot of mixing of different social spheres, you know. So a guy who might be a little shadier than you think ends up in, you know. But I idolize these people. Like it was a really hard crash for me to meet these heroes and find out that they were like this. Like I didn't think that when I got started. And I thought these were like professional people trying to help my career.

[00:41:35] And I had no idea that this guy would call another salon and talk badly about you or try to get you fired or try to hurt like what you built or a nag you in the middle of a haircut or a siting so you feel kind of like less than yourself. Like that kind of stuff is very hard for like an introverted person just trying to cut hair to weed through and make a career. Well, that's the thing. A lot of people that we work for are narcissists and they know exactly how to play this game. And they know exactly how to go through and throw, you know, control over people.

[00:42:05] And that's exact. And they were hoping that you would fall for it because so many victims. I did. So they know exactly what to do. Well, it's funny. And as you say that, it's just like that's what I was looking up to, I guess, at the time. I was trying to be a narcissist and it just didn't come very naturally. But thank God. Maybe I would have been more famous if I wasn't. In some days, not famous. People have been telling stories about me. I know, right? Nowadays, there's not much of a difference between being infamous and being famous. The notoriety and fame are kind of melded together.

[00:42:34] Well, and the culture just has no place for these monsters. There's definitely that. I think that the new generation of hairdresser is there. That's what I like. Yeah. That's what I like, you know? So guys, it was a pleasure talking to you. I love that we had like a husband and wife duo. And John, it was awesome to see you and talk to you and catch up. And I really appreciate it. Thank you, guys. Thanks for being here. All right.

[00:43:04] It is time for some shitology. Would you rather let a drunk, sleazy Italian have his way with you or throw yourself down onto broken glass and bleed out in an ambulance? Those are your choices. Remember that paramedic pulling shards out of your ass might just be your soulmate. To all you narcissist piece of shit salon owners with no employees left to harass or gaslight,

[00:43:32] there's a Tuesday night meeting just for you. You've heard of the 12 steps. Well, this one just has one. Blame everybody else. Now you and the other assholes will have plenty of time to talk about all those other hairdressers who just don't get it. And with that, stay shitty. Sprechen wir doch mal über deinen Traumtyp. Oh, schwierig. Schieß los.

[00:43:59] Okay, er muss für jedes Abenteuer zu haben sein und natürlich toll aussehen. Und er darf mich nie lang warten lassen. Klingt verdächtig nach dem neuen Ford Puma Gen E. Der lädt schneller als dein Smartphone von 10 auf 80 Prozent in nur 23 Minuten. Hm, dann muss ich wohl mal Probefahren. Der neue Ford Puma Gen E. Jetzt Probefahrt buchen auf ford.de. Hey, listener persons. Thanks for listening.

[00:44:28] And if you like our show, please help us grow the podcast by giving us a rating and review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeart Radio, Amazon Prime, or wherever you get your favorite shit. It definitely helps our algorithm and it's free to do. Also, if you'd like to get your story on our podcast, go to our website at shititoldmyhairdresser.com where you can get your voicemail on our show by using the green mic icon. Or you can send us an email at info at shititoldmyhairdresser.com. And if you like us, tell 10 of your friends.

[00:44:58] And if you hate us, tell 20. And remember, stay shitty, listener persons.

[00:45:41] And enjoy yourself on this next episode.