Living with Lindsay Lohan Nearly Broke Me, Adam Garland

[00:00:01] Hey guys, normally we go through and we say something a little bit funny at the beginning of the show, but this next interview that you're about to listen to, when we say the quiet parts out loud, it was fucking screamed out loud. And it got raw and just all the feelings. So this is definitely from one hairdresser to another. This gets really fucking deep. I hope you guys really listen up. Yes, and tons of respect to this guest. All the respect and adoration.

[00:00:29] Real hairdressers telling real stories about their experiences from behind the salon chair. And we are now saying the quiet parts out loud. This is Shit I Told My Hairdresser.

[00:00:51] Hello everybody and welcome back to another fucking episode of Sh!t I told my Hairdresser. Paula, how are you? I'm doing fantastic. I had my teeth cleaned today, what do you think? Hey, me too. I've had mine done. I'm sparkly clean as well.

[00:01:19] I'm just drinking coffee, so mine are probably brown. Yeah, mine are too. Guys, we want to thank everybody for going through and giving us a follow. Guys, remember, this is a word of mouth podcast, just like the industry. We want our friends to hear about us and know about us. So help Paula and I hurt some little ears and tell 20 of your friends that you hate about us and 10 that you like. All right. Follow us on Instagram and on TikTok. Subscribe to us on Apple Podcasts.

[00:01:47] We would really appreciate it. And tell your mom, you know what I mean? Because I'm pretty sure your mom, we want to talk to your mom about this. So anyhow, we have someone very special. I've been really excited about going through and doing this recording with someone over in London. His name is Adam Garland. And he has an Instagram, which I went down that rabbit hole. Paula, did you go down that rabbit hole? I did it until 2 o'clock. And then, yeah, 2 o'clock.

[00:02:15] And then I woke up at probably 6 this morning and did the same thing. I was at my dentist office just looking at him. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. My phone down. I think I irritated my dental hygienist. Fuck him. Fuck him. This is more important. Fuck him. But, Adam, you were talking about like just hair history and makeup history. And this is one of the things that hairdressers, they're on Instagram watching like TikTok dances or Instagram dances and whatnot.

[00:02:44] And the hairdressers really need to be paying attention to what you're saying because I think it's really important because it gives a roadmap. What you're doing is giving a roadmap to hairdressers on what we're doing present day and how it's so relevant. And you go into history about hair and makeup and fashion and why we're doing it. This is like that devil's wear Prada moment. You know what I mean? Where she's explaining, you know what I mean, why she's wearing a certain color.

[00:03:13] Adam does that with his Instagram. And to me, I was fascinated. I started following him. And I'm like, we got to get you on, you know. And we had an amazing talk. And now here we are doing this recording. Adam, tell everybody a little bit about yourself, if you don't mind, and kind of like how you started and then what you're doing now. I would love to hear your backstory. I'm dying to hear your backstory. Yeah. Okay. Well, hey, listeners. Thank you for hosting me. And I'm Adam.

[00:03:42] I'm 43 years young. And I've been a hairdresser since I was 14. I started in a rural seaside coastal town in the UK. And very quickly, I found myself at Tony and Guy, then at Vidal Sassoon. And I thought I was the best hairdresser in the world. And by 19, I was the dog's bollocks. And fuck everyone else. And how little I knew, not only about hairdressing, but also about myself.

[00:04:08] And then we've had, I can't do the math, 24 years of evolution to getting sat here today talking to you. And it's been a journey. And when I trained at Tony and Guy, first of all, I remember we had these sectioning clips. And this was, so I was 16. So I can't do the maths that quick, but a long time ago. And we would wear these sectioning clips. And they had Tony and Guy written across the front.

[00:04:37] And we'd put them on to walk from the salon down to go and get a coffee or to get a pizza at lunchtime. And I just remember thinking, like, I had, like, the colonel badge of, like, some military. I was like, I'm the bollocks. And if I didn't have them on me from what I was doing, I'd go and find clips before I put them on. I guess there's a lot of ego playing into that. But there was also that respect for the brand. The brand that was sort of rocketing and really cool at that time.

[00:05:05] I think Raw had, like, not long been out. And I was in Bristol, which is quite a big city in the UK. And it was a massive salon. And it wasn't company owned, but it was heavily connected. They did art team every week. And I just remember going there. And I can smell it now. The honey and oat treatment. Fuck yeah. That was the best shit ever. Yeah. I smell that now. It just takes me back to my youth. And I didn't, I wasn't fully committed.

[00:05:33] So life, my personality, my upbringing, I was very erratic. But it did teach me, I was there for about eight months as an assistant. I'd done a little bit before. And it just fed me that level of what hairdressing could be beyond a blue rinse and rollers, which I wish that I'd learned a little bit more about. But maybe I'll get to that as I get through this.

[00:05:59] So it was a brilliant sort of introduction to hairdressing, to work at that company at that time. I then went to London and someone suggested I went, I wanted to get it done. I was like, that was my, I was very black and white, black, right. Let's get it done now. I want to be a hairdresser now. Yeah. And I paid back then, I paid, I think, 15,000 pounds. So Christ knows what that would equate to today. Whoa.

[00:06:26] To do nine months at Sassoon. And you just start from the beginning and you just go through the whole academy system. And day one, I'm going to show you this now, but I've got this, which was the Tony, it wasn't the Tony and Guy book when I arrived, but you know, this is cool. Color. Oh yeah. Pretty. They had a version of that. I get to Sassoon. I haven't got it here, but it was black and white. Every image was black and white. And every image looked like it was from, well, it was from 50 years ago.

[00:06:55] And I'm like, why have I come here? What the hell am I going to do here? How does that work? Having come out of Tony and Guy and gone into that. And I'd heard of it as Sassoon, but I was not aware of what it would do for me throughout my whole life, not just as a hairdresser. So Annie Humphries was teaching me color. I was not interested. I did. I had no respect. I had no, I, I, I'm one of these hair. I was one of these hairdressers that I see today who probably has no idea who Annie Humphries is.

[00:07:25] Probably never will. Yeah. And so I can connect with that version of myself then who was disrespectful. I didn't want to do color. I hated color. It's too messy. So I just didn't show up and I'm paying like all this money. I went to LA for two weeks just on holiday and I told them I was ill and I look back now and I'm like, oh, I shudder even telling you this. Yeah. And the shit, right? Oh my God. So we, we did pin curls. We did finger waves. Again, I didn't want to do that. I didn't want to style hair.

[00:07:54] All I wanted to do was cut hair and blow dry hair. And so I've got to be really honest, like for the first 12 weeks, three months, a third of the course, I didn't really give a shit. I was just going. And then we started cutting and a phenomenal teacher, Cher Savory, she was one of my teachers. I mean, I had all the greats. There was Tim Hartley. There was Melvin. Yeah. Incredible people. Wow. Yeah. When I started cutting hair, cause that's what I wanted to do.

[00:08:23] I really started to get into it. And yeah, I mean, I thrived there. It was fantastic. There was people from all over the world. You know, we're going back 20 odd years and I'm also, I'm from a small seaside town and all of a sudden I'm with Korean people. I'm with all these different cultures and, and I wasn't brought up in a diverse background. We, you know, we had maybe one Indian family down that end of the road and a black family, but you know, it just wasn't.

[00:08:48] And I just remember like being so overwhelmed and like, this is amazing. I just want to experience people. And I, I've always had that connection and that love for people. So I did my course there and yeah, that was it. I, I was Sassoon. So I applied to work for Sassoon and they wouldn't even give me the second interview. And I was like, Oh shit. Wow. So, um, and I, I passed really well by the way, and I'm really proud of what I did and

[00:09:14] I stand by my work and I was good, you know, whatever reason I didn't get a job there, I didn't. So I went to work for a place called Harrington's, which was just around the corner, which was another prestigious salon and it had some great people. And it was when I walked through that door, having a Sassoon diploma and knowing, not really realizing the level of cutting skill that I'd absorbed. I knew it was kind of good, but I didn't realize that I didn't, I wasn't that good, but I didn't realize my education was that good.

[00:09:44] And sort of, you know, people coming over and asking me about things and then you've so I was there for like six weeks, just doing clients, getting up to speed. And it, it was just, it was the first time that I was like starting to like use my skills, not in a teaching environment and starting to think, Oh, okay, maybe this does make sense. Like starting to understand what Sassoon was also the like methodology of the way of working

[00:10:09] and the way you operate with a client and all those little things that I don't know whether they still teach those things today in the salons, but, um, you know how you'd put the towel around and just how you'd bring someone in coming down to their level in the chair. All these little things were like, it's not just about picking up the scissors and doing the haircut. It's about the experience, the client experience, selling products, looking at hair textures. I was also very grateful, which we can come full circle later with things in styling.

[00:10:38] I cut Afro hair. I cut Asian hair. I didn't see any divide in any hair because it all came through Sassoon. So I learned how to style Afro texture, coily hair. What, you know, I learned all those things. I just, that was second nature. Um, so my, my Sassoon education really did set me up for life as a hairdresser, but also in that methodology and the way of working.

[00:11:04] And when I teach session, I just always naturally revert back to, it wasn't ABC when I was at Sassoon. And it was something, it was even before that, but it's that kind of methodology of get here one, two, three. So correct. It becomes almost like muscle memory. You know what I mean? That they're going through and you're doing it. And that is one of the things now as well, the two, as I always tell people, I ask people about their education. I'll simply just ask them a certain question, like what builds up weight, what takes out weight. And they have no idea what I'm talking about.

[00:11:34] Absolutely. But that was one thing that I'll be really honest. I didn't get, and you, you gotta go, what? I came out soon, not knowing how to build up weight. I never, the penny never dropped. So I would actually always, I would always lay ahead to try and get a bob, even though I could do a graduated bob, I can build that up. But then I try it. And that goes back to what I was saying. Like I had this amazing experience, but at 19, I was not the bollocks, but I thought

[00:12:02] I was because I realized that I had this as soon education, but I couldn't graduate. I couldn't graduate hair. I couldn't understand what you just said. I would have gone, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. But I've been like, what does he mean building up weight? And so even when you have an aptitude for learning, which I do, you've gone to, in my opinion, one of the best places in the world. One thing that I think is really important in any career, but especially in this, you need time and you need to experience different hair types.

[00:12:30] You need to experience different textures and that can't be done even in nine months of going through an academy process. That comes with life experience, talking to people, having a creative language. And these are things that I don't think I got taught or didn't continue learning at that point. I was driven by ego. I thought I was the bollocks. I thought Kate Moss would just walk in one day and say, oh, I want him to cut my hair because he's the creative director of the salon. I knew nothing about styling hair.

[00:12:59] I could only use a rat Denman brush. So I couldn't use him. I could do it. But I was like, I didn't understand the concept. So I was very well versed, but I was also full of ego and very narrow minded in a way. And that went on for quite a while. I'm going to be honest. So what changed your mind from that point, though? I mean, where did you kind of have that moment of clarity where you're kind of like, something's got to change. I need to go through and look at things a little bit differently. Wow. Okay.

[00:13:27] We may have to build up to get there. But I feel like I'll tell you how I ended up leaving London and coming back to my hometown. I was out clubbing one night and I met a friend of Gwen Stefani and I ended up back at Gwen Stefani's house. I've never actually talked about this public shit. Okay. Well, fuck it. I was with very influential people. Shit. They're going to find out.

[00:13:53] Basically, I drank ketamine by mistake and ended up in a coma 26 hours on a life support machine. Oh. Wrong place, wrong time. I wasn't trying to commit suicide. I wasn't trying to drink ketamine. It was just a stack of like things. I wake up on a life support machine with my mom there and I'm like, fuck. And I came home. They took me home, brought me back from London. And at that point, I wasn't really in addiction and I wasn't really partying like that. I mean, I was around those circles.

[00:14:22] I was kind of recreationally enjoying. We're hairdressers. Come on. Like, you know what goes on. I never did. Yeah. But you know where to get coke. You know what I mean? It's like we're hairdressers. You know what I mean? I did. I've never done coke. And if you asked me, I'd be like, oh, right over there. You snow. And we know that. Yeah. We know that. There's those people within that. So I was partying. Partying too hard. And it bit me in the ass. Came home. And so I was humbled.

[00:14:51] I mean, I was lucky to be alive. And I dipped in and out of London, maintained friendships with these people. The Gwen Stefani thing is just, it's interesting how someone from a small seaside town who I don't look for that. I've gone through the phases of sort of wanting to work with famous people. I work with who I work with because I enjoy the process. And you get to do some amazing things with VIPs. But that's, again, further down.

[00:15:19] I'm going to pull us out of my early bit very soon. That's all right. The point is, I kind of have this, I always end up in those circles or those situations. It's like, it was so random that that happened, but that happened. And it's gone on to happen throughout my life. You know, I've gone, I've assisted. And the first job I assist on, I'm stood next to Karl Lagerfeld at Chanel. And I'm like, shit.

[00:15:44] You know, and then one of the first models I do at Chanel for Sam McKnight, by the way, that was not me doing Chanel for myself. I was assisting. One of the first models I get asked to do is Kendall Jenner. And then I'm working with Gigi Hadid. And I'm like, it's quite overwhelming coming from a small seaside town and then being thrust into that environment. So. And it happens really, really fast. And without you even knowing it. It did. I remember being in London, working for Tony and Guy. And they're like, hey, Fashion Week is this week while you're here.

[00:16:14] You know, do you want to go and do some shows? You know what I mean? The next thing you know, you're kind of walking around. There's like, there's like, someone's like, hey, Kate Moss is right behind you. And you're like, what? It's just, you're right there in the middle of it. And you're not, it wasn't like I woke up that morning thinking like I'll be meeting her or, you know what I mean? Seeing like Florence from, you know, Machine or something like that. It just happened. Yeah. And then go out for drinks, you know what I mean? And the next thing you know, the same crowd kind of moves over to here. It just happens, you know? So it's just, and then you're around, they recognize you, you know?

[00:16:43] And so then you're no longer a threat. So they kind of invite you in. Yeah. You know, it's just weird how that happens. You know what I mean? But no, I get it. I think it was, I mean, just to bridge the gap and then we'll get to session. So I came home and I sort of did a few, I did freelance. I was working. I did very well freelance because I was assumed trained in a small seaside town. People were like, Jesus, this guy. I had a really big clientele. And then I learned how to do extensions with a company called Raccoon when Victoria Beckham had them in.

[00:17:13] And I was putting these individual beads in with burning your fingers. I mean, the people still do that. Yeah. And having to use acetone to get it out. But again, I met in my hometown. I met a famous person and I started doing her hair. And it's like, I just bumped into this succession of things. And so I was doing all what we call glamour models, FHM magazine and sort of these were we call them lads mags over here.

[00:17:43] There was a culture of boobies out kind of thing. Oh, yeah. I started doing all the extensions for those girls. Again, I was so I was already doing session, but I didn't I still didn't know that that's what I was doing. I didn't know that that was editorial. I just had this one line, which I was so off the catwalk as if I'd ever been near a catwalk at this point in my life was in my early 20s. I'd never been near a runway assisted or anything. But my line was like, oh, yeah, darling, let's make it look so off the runway. And I was doing it with hair extensions.

[00:18:13] And yeah, you know, and I'm really making a lot of mistakes. I made a lot of mistakes in that interim period. And so fast forward, I did something else and I separated with a partner. And I was like, what am I going to do in my life? And I'm approaching 30. And I went to Tony and Guy. I blagged my way through the academy and I got the creative director's job in the Philippines for Tony and Guy. And I'd not varded. I'd not been at Tony and Guy, but I knew I got the book.

[00:18:43] I got the book, which was the essentials, essentials, haircuts. I'd learned how to do them badly. And I went into the academy and I got assessed by Indira, Cos, and they were assessing me for the Philippines role. And they were looking at me and I hadn't cut hair like that in a salon environment for nearly a decade or at least eight years. And they're like, then the boss of the salon had come over to do some training and to meet

[00:19:12] me before I got the role. And they're like, are you sure you want to take this guy in as your creative director? And they were like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm over to the Philippines. So all of a sudden I'm over to the Philippines, creative director for Tony and Guy over there. It's called Essentials. And it only lasted about six months, not because of the hairdressing, but I didn't like, I actually didn't like being a Westerner and taking away from a culture. It was the first time I really started to. Connect with sort of my values and my beliefs.

[00:19:39] And I was earning a lot more money than somebody else who could color hair better than me. But she was native. And I was just like, I just didn't like that. It was the first time I started to understand my beliefs, my morals, what was true to me. So I left there. Then I went to Holland and I was the art director for Tony and Guy Rotterdam for about 18 months. And at this point, I started doing session at this point, but I started doing it myself. The hair, the makeup, everything.

[00:20:06] And it was there that one of my friends, another person that I knew from London, phones me and says, do you want to come to LA and do wigs for Cher? And I'm like, what? He's like, I'm like, yeah. Wigs? I was like more terrified about wigs. I'd never touched a wig unless I'd got a play wig, you know, those plastic 299 things. And I'm like, of course I can. I'm the Dallas-Sasoon train. I'm an art director for Tony and Guy. I can do that.

[00:20:33] So in a nutshell, I was going to do the dancers wigs. And I went to LA and this was at a point where I was heavily using meth. I was a functioning addict. So I got to LA and I got given a credit card and got told I could go to the main place in LA to get the wigs and everything.

[00:20:59] And I remember picking up a comb and I'm like, it was a comb and it was like $10. And I was like, am I allowed this? And they were like, Adam, you need to get everything. And that, so I was really overwhelmed and I was, I was, I was working through my addiction. And so I styled these wigs and then I got on it for a couple of days. And then it just, it was messy. I did the wigs. I left LA probably a week later than I should have because I couldn't get on the plane because

[00:21:29] I was such a mess. And I come back to my hometown again. And that's the first time that I sort of understood what recovery was or thought, okay, we're going to have a look at this. Subsequently, Cher chose one of the wigs that I'd cut, a red wig. We can maybe insert the picture in if I can find it. And I'd had no social media or anything at the point. This was, I think this was 2012 or 2010. And she performed in a wig that I'd cut.

[00:21:58] And I think I just had a moment of like clarity validation or I went, oh, okay, maybe, maybe I can do this with something here. So then my little ego sent emails out to all the agents in an, in, I didn't know what an agent was, but sent all my email out to the agents with my horrific portfolio. I really hope I can find these emails by the way, because I'm going to do a post and I'm going to share it all. I was like, I'm the bollocks because I'm always the bollocks and you need to represent me.

[00:22:28] And I got no responses. I thought I was going to come back to London having done wigs on Cher whilst on meth. Never met Cher, by the way. I also like, it wasn't, it was like, it was in a hotel room doing the wigs. There's no fantasy story here. And, um, and nobody replied to me and I was like, fuck. Fuck. And I don't know how, but I think I met a makeup artist actually, Mona. And she told me about assisting.

[00:22:55] And that was the very beginning of me then reaching back out to the agencies in a different way. And then I got my lucky break with Sam at night. And then I'm off to Chanel Couture. Um, began the next phase. So that's quite a long time getting through the beginning bit. I think you asked. Yeah, that's fine. I gave it to you. But that's the thing is that it takes a journey. Everyone thinks that they're going to get out of beauty school and then they're going to

[00:23:24] be making a hundred thousand dollars a year. And it's like until, and that's what drove me to you was that you're going through and you're showing the history. You're showing like what you've gone through. You're showing other people have gone through, you know, and it's like, this is part of your story. So it is important. You know what I mean? Because everyone thinks that they're going to go through, like you said, send a letter out and they're all going to love you and they're all going to hire you. And it's like, no, you got to clean the toilets first. Yep. Well, clean the toilets first. You know what I mean?

[00:23:53] Well, and I think what's incredible is that you made the choice at one point you made the choice. Do I want the addiction or do I want my career? What do I really want? And that's, that's bravery. Huge bravery. But that, that is, however, that choice has taken until 18 months ago to really be able to sit here as Adam Garland, who is confident, happy, self-worth, self-belief, healthy ego, boundaries. All of those things is taken.

[00:24:21] It took another say 10 years to get to this place. And I want to be really honest. I now am sat in my dad's garage. I'm in my hometown again. This year, I've probably turned over £1,000 and I am building from the bottom up. And that is what you're seeing on social media. And I want to be really honest. I'm in a garage now. We've all been here. We've all done that. This is where I am.

[00:24:47] And I, I want to share that because I think a lot of people, I've had the, I've had the £100,000 contract, I've earned a shitload of money and I've wasted it, whatever. But I think you can always, I've always come back to hairdressing. I've always loved image making, but I never really understood that I loved image making. And I think what I'm doing now is because I'm sober for 18 months, because I've really looked at myself and I've been humble enough all the way through my life, even though I had

[00:25:17] that ego, I think I've always, I've always been a good person. I know that I've, I've always been kind, I've always been caring, probably to my detriment. I've always been a good egg. I've not been a baddie, but I've had issues and I've had to, had to explore that. But you know, I'm, I'm going to make a success of whatever this thing becomes because I love what I do. I love sharing. I love connecting with people. I love community. And I'm now able to do that in a way that I've never been able to experience before because

[00:25:44] I've never been connected to you without worrying about what I think you're thinking about me. I hope that makes sense. So let's, let's talk about what you're doing now. You know what I mean? Because I think that's what like really drove, drove me like to you and what you're doing. You know what I mean? It's like, why are you talking about like the history of makeup and hair? Why is it important to you? And then we can talk about also who are your most influential people. So we didn't get those names out there. You know what I mean? So it's like.

[00:26:13] I don't want to hear this too, because I thought I was on top of things with my workshops with the history of makeup, but watching your Instagram, mind blown. I watched them over and over and sent them to all my friends. I'm all, this is incredible. You need to watch this guy. I mean, and you were just popping off all of this information right off the top of your head. Super impressive. Thank you. I don't have an answer as to what this is. And I've been doing this for six months.

[00:26:43] The fifth, I think the fourth of November, I went on to TikTok and I went, this is about to happen and I don't know what it is, but come with me if you want to come along. Fuck yeah. Get my journey. There's different reasons that have implemented where I've got to the recovery, but also I live with a disability called muscular dystrophy, FSHD. So I'm losing my ability to bend down, to work, but I can still work.

[00:27:09] But it's been something that I've been learning to accept over the last four or five years. That with taking the pause, going into what I call ghost mode for a year and a half, actually putting down everything and really understanding what am I doing? What do I want to say? What do I want to create? I've always loved sharing and educating. I've run my own courses. I've always been able to be a mentor within salon environments, et cetera.

[00:27:37] And as a lead artist on shows, and I've produced and nurtured some really talented artists that were talented in their own right, but we work together. And I'm on this journey now where understanding how an image is created, I thought was just second nature. I think for a long time, you just go on set and you know, that's the stylist, that's the art director, that's the producer, that's the call sheet. You go, all that stuff.

[00:28:06] It's just not readily available. You can't go to university and get given this. And it's going to be different. It's something born with. I have to tell you right now, it's something I have taught so many seminars and have been interviewed by so many photographers and they say, how do you think this stuff up? What inspires you? I go to sleep thinking about this stuff. I wake up thinking about it. It's something you're totally born with and you can't help yourself. You have to create that beauty that you want to see in people. And I found my medium when I found faces.

[00:28:35] Oh my gosh, my whole career just took off. So it just sounds like you're experiencing the same thing. It's organic. You can't make it up. It is exactly what you just described as well. I've just posted, literally before this went out, I posted a video of Anne von De Paris and the amazing hair sculptures. And so I do my research and I spend quite a bit of time working on each video and looking

[00:29:02] at the key facts and things that I like, things that I think people should know or could know that could broaden their knowledge culturally within the industry. Technique. Technique is anyone can do technique. It's what you do with that technique and how you use that technique. And that, in my opinion, comes from having a broader knowledge of what is going on, what is happening at the time. Where did that come from in the history? And then you can start to sort of recreate and start to, I like that.

[00:29:32] I don't like that. And it's okay not to like that. And the one I've just posted, this hair image blew my mind when it's 100 years old or over 100 years old. And I'm like, Jesus. It's like this sculptural Anne von De Paris kind of stuff. And I've done that kind of work before. And I've looked at the reference and I've gone, oh yeah, I love the reference. The reference is Anne von De Paris. And then what? Okay. So you're going to ask me a question and I'm like, okay.

[00:30:01] But now I can tell you it's from like the early 1900s and he created the bob, but he's not just famous for creating the bob. And when he created the bob, it was at that moment when women were being, it was rebellious. And actually to have a bob cut in the early 1900s, you had to go to the doctor to get a prescription in order to go to a barber because women weren't allowed in barbershop. So my point is, and you can see how excited I'm getting, learning the depth and the culture behind all these things.

[00:30:30] I get, I've got a feet, I'm very connected to a feet and I've got a sensation now going through my body. It excites me to understand the history. I feel more connected then to what I'm doing. And I can genuinely say I like this because I like it, what it represents as an image, but I also like some of the story behind it. But then when you start doing that, you then go off, the thing I told you about the bob, it's a bit of research I did on a bob.

[00:30:58] And then you go, oh, okay, that takes you there. And then it's like Joan of Arc was the inspiration for Anton when he cut the bob. And then it becomes endless. Then you just like that. And that has been sort of where I've been at recently with my archiving and with my building my research. I have to have clear parameters that it's like you have to stop researching at a certain point and then go and make the content. And what I want to bring to, so I can't tell you what this is, but this is like an archive

[00:31:26] of beauty and image makeup creation, hair makeup. But not just that. It's like the history, the culture. And it's then what I can't wait to do, which I've done a little bit of is actually get back doing hair with this knowledge. But I'm in no rush to do anything. I'm sort of for the first time in my career, I'm enjoying the process. I'm reminding myself like, I don't think what I'm doing has been done in the way.

[00:31:53] Well, it hasn't because it's not been done by me, but what I'm building has never been created. But I can't tell you what that is because it hasn't been done. But I have this kind of, I want to, I've got mentees already. I've got mental, sorry, mental people online. I never thought that would even be possible. And I've already got one of my mentees has got an interview to be someone's first assistant in New York. And I'm like, wow. Oh, okay. Just from helping him, where's an email?

[00:32:18] From helping him clean up his Instagram and also helping him be very honest. It's like, actually your asset as a 23 year old kid, that's never, well man, who's never assisted before. That is your strength. That is not your weakness because you are moldable. You are someone that is, he, when I, when I chatted to this guy, he talked passionately about hair history. He knew who Vidal Sassoon was and he knew something else. And I was like, this kid's got it. We can take you on this journey.

[00:32:46] So that's one part of what I'm doing. I want to launch a podcast in September. And I just want to go with this and create and see what, what comes. See, that's the most important part about what you're doing is you're creating this journey, even though you don't know where it's kind of like heading. That's the whole point. You know what I mean? It's just like, but you have something special right there. And that's what kind of gravitated me towards your work. Then we found out that we knew a lot of the same people.

[00:33:16] But, but it was like, if a lot of hairdressers, when people ask them, my clients go and do the ask, but I hear this. I hear this all the time. What do you see happening? Why is it happening? Clients want to know. And they, they like, well, this is what they're doing in LA. This is what I saw on like refine a website or something like that. I'm like, no, no, you got to go through the history of what, when did this come from? You know what I mean? It's like, you know, when did the nineties happen? What are we doing now with hair?

[00:33:42] You know, and that's what you're sharing with people is you're sharing that insight, you know, but in a very cool way on Instagram. And the thing is that what, what, what I'm getting out of this is you don't have to have a destination. You don't have to have an end game. You're enjoying the journey. And that is very important in life in general. It's not the destination gets your happiness. It's enjoying the journey in the moment and you're enjoying how happy you are. I'm looking at myself, right? I I've done interviews and things and I would normally be cringing sitting here and I'm,

[00:34:12] I'm smiling, which I'm just, I'm really present, you know? And I almost cried. I've never got to this point previously where I'm comfortable. I think that's really important that I, I say that it's like, I never thought I could become comfortable. I didn't know what that meant. I'd be like, oh yeah, I'm fine. I'm fine. But no, I wasn't okay. You can pause. I paused. And I, as I shared already, I've made no money this year and I'm, I'm in my garage and

[00:34:38] I'm building something, but I've never had so much and it's not a material thing. I've got everything. I'm also building a community and I'm meeting people. I'm talking to people like Sandy Linter and Harry King. I was going to meet up with him in London. Unfortunately, we couldn't, we couldn't get it. You know, Harry King is like an icon who, who started session in the sixties and seventies and he's someone that Sam McKnight was inspired by.

[00:35:05] And you're like, shit, I've worked for Sam, but now I'm, I'm connecting with these people. And like Sandy's just like, he's so like, I love it when she sends me a DM and it's like, yeah, it's just about reinvention. And it's like, these, these people are people I would have never touched had I just been on whatever route I thought I needed to be on to be a fashion person. It's so true. As soon as I started this podcast, I didn't think that I'd be like having people like you

[00:35:32] onto the show where I'm texting Orlando Pita and I'm like someone who I idolize, you know what I mean? It's my value. I mean, I'm like, holy shit, this is so cool. I get like Alan Edwards on. Alan Edwards, man. I was like, yeah. Yeah. And these are really people who, you know, made what we're looking at now, you know what I mean? I'm doing now. They are like the fathers of these creations, you know, from like Madonna to Farrah Fawcett. I mean, it's just crazy.

[00:36:00] And humble people, very humble people. Very humble people. I did Orlando's, obviously I've known Orlando's work in Orlando for decades. And I did his post and he followed me and I was like, holy shit, this was quite near the beginning of doing these videos. And I, yeah, I followed him. I followed me back and I was like, oh shit. And then he like communicated. And I was like, again, another thing I've learned through doing conversations like this. I've spoken to a few people recently.

[00:36:29] I'm not here because I want anything from you or from a text from Orlando Peter. In the past, it would be, oh, what could that have done to get me there, to get me with that person? Or, or could if I post a video of him and Hathaway might all that bullshit stinking thinking that I did that was driven by being so uncomfortable with who I am detracted from the fact that I was in the moment and communicating with an icon who I look up to, who, like you said, has got this legacy.

[00:36:57] And I think because of where I've got to now, it's just happening organically. And I'm not trying to make that happen. You've, you connected with me. I've met you all of these. You're building a community without realizing you're building a community without even realizing it. But for a long time, I would, and I think that's what the industry can do to you. I think that's within, within any industry. You can, you, you're never present. You're always thinking about what it is you haven't got, especially in the arts, especially with Instagram and social media.

[00:37:25] You're posting your work and then you see someone post something and you're like, well, how did they get that shoot? Why was I not picked for that? Because I worked with that photographer last time. And I'm like, even as I'm saying that now, I'm cringing, but I used to say all those things. I used to think those things. And I didn't use to think it just as a little one-off. I would probably be fucked up for days going, well, that guy did that shoot with my photographer, you know, my photographer, because I've worked with him two or three times. It's absolutely batshit crazy. Yeah.

[00:37:54] The toxicity within this industry as well. And I think it's really important to be aware there is a dark side to this industry. And there is. Yeah. The dark side is in your own head. And the stories you tell yourself. Yes. Yes. When you feel rejected like that. Right. And we. Nothing to do with you. Yeah. We need to, we need to talk about that because you have had that moment of clarity and that, like, I can totally tell you're in a different state of consciousness now, you know, what,

[00:38:23] what did it take? What was it? Well, you, you told me the story. I think we need to get into it now. What got you sober? Because I mean, I, I've been, I've been sober six years, over six years now. You know what I mean? And it was just like, I've never, I've never had more peace in my entire life. You know what I mean? So let's, let's talk about that a little bit. What, what got you there? I mean, there's, I don't know whether you're thinking about the famous person, but to answer that question, I think that was part of your journey.

[00:38:51] I mean, to answer, to answer that question, honestly, I need to tell you a slightly different story and I'll try and tell you quickly if you like, but I, but the last time I lapsed, it was a mess. And so I go into crazy psychosis and it was at the end of 2024 and I just had had enough. And I just had hit that point where I was like, I'll do anything to never touch a substance. Drink was never a problem, but I don't drink. And, um, I surrendered to it, but all that kind of therapy stuff, whatever.

[00:39:20] So that, that was how I got to this place. Um, and how I got to the relapse is kind of quite interesting. And it's, I'll be quite honest. I was leading shows at fashion week and I was a global face of a brand and I was earning a significant amount of money. And for a reason, which maybe we can touch on another time. I, I got publicly called out by one of my team members.

[00:39:48] Um, and it was, it wasn't true what she said, but I was a representative of a brand and it had things to do with race and the brand just went no. And I, yeah, I was called out publicly as being racist on social media the day. And, um, and I, I've never talked about it. I wasn't sure we, I was going to go near this this evening, but it's something that as a white

[00:40:15] guy and as, as a man, a gay man who has always been inclusive as far as I am aware and has never consciously been prejudiced or intentionally held any prejudice to anybody. I also walk life with a disability. So I understand prejudice on a level. I'm not saying it's the same, but to have that accusation made. And it was, it was just not true.

[00:40:42] The things that were said were lies, but then to be so in the middle of fashion week, my mum had just had a stroke the day that I left for fashion week and I didn't know she was dying and I had no support network other than my first assistant and my second assistant. I had a manager who did the best she could for damage control. Everybody else, they just wanted me to get through fashion week to support the brand, to do the interviews with Vogue. And then they dropped me.

[00:41:10] So I didn't know if my mum was going to die. Been called out publicly as racist. I've been told not to say anything. I'm a white man. I can never say anything against a black woman. My brain was fucked, lost, lost my, one of my major sources of income and what I perceived was my identity. So I lost, I lost the contract. I lost the fashion week, which was so important to that perception that I had of who I was at the time.

[00:41:38] And subsequently that, that ended up months later in a, in a lapse. And it's the best thing that ever happened to me. And I'm so grateful for that girl doing what she did. If that was what it took for me to connect with myself. And I'm going to, at some point, talk about that. It's a very delicate subject. Yes. I agree. And, um, and I feel like talking with you, I feel very comfortable how I've just, I didn't

[00:42:06] prepare that or anything. That's just. Oh, no, no, no. Yeah. That's what makes this so raw and so real. You know what I mean? Yes. Like you have to, I hold my sobriety very close to my chest because I had people in my life use it against me. You know what I mean? And so now that I own it and then I have it, you know what I mean? I have, like I was saying, I live in a different state of consciousness now, you know what I mean? And it's like really important to be there and I'm at peace and I can say whatever the fuck I want, whatever the fuck I want.

[00:42:34] And I have love and I mean that. And it took, it took work because I could say, oh yeah, I love those people. But I actually have love for all of it. I have love for everyone, but I have love for all of that experience. The, the fashion week, the brand dropping me, the people that walked out. All of that stuff. I have genuine love and compassion without needing anything back from that. I'm, I'm totally cool with who I am and comfortable.

[00:43:01] And, um, I, I, I wouldn't change. It took, it took about six to eight months into 2025 to really get to a place to go. Oh, all of that identity, that persona, that fakeness that I was chasing so hard. That was never me. And now I'm sat here very comfortable and very happy as who I am. Should we get back to the, uh, should we get back to something? Should we go juicy? Should we go? Yeah. I was going to say, let's, let's get a little juicy now.

[00:43:31] You know what I mean? Cause it's like, yeah. So tell us some shit, honey. You and I connected on a certain name because we know this person. And because all of our friends, it was like, we, oddly enough, we kind of were surrounded by the same people, but it's in different countries. Oddly enough. You know what I mean? So when we started talking about it, I was just kind of like, oh yeah, I know exactly what you mean. I, I never signed any NDAs.

[00:43:58] And before I do, before I talk about this, I would normally in the old identity have been worried that when this goes out, no celebrity will ever book me, but I don't give a fuck if you don't want to book me because I'm going to tell a story and don't book me, babe. It's okay. Cause I'm, I'm good today. Um, and there was a lot of that in the industry and we do have to be careful. We do have to respect people's privacy. We do get to see things. We get to be in environments that you wouldn't normally be in.

[00:44:25] And you see people in vulnerable positions, but then there can be a line that gets crossed by people. And when me or you are vulnerable and then somebody is exploiting that, it's not okay. That's a different story. And I, I, again, get a phone call and say, do you want to come and work in Dubai with a celebrity, but we can't tell you who it is. And I was like, no. They're like, well, will you come if we tell you who it is?

[00:44:54] And I was like, maybe. And I was like, Lindsay Lohan. I was like, oh yeah, tell her it's me. I've done her hair already. And anyway, right. Get, get there. And it's absolute hot mess. And, um, I, I, I'd worked with her just to get her ready to go to the airplane one time. And it was fine. I mean, that was, yeah, whatever in London. But, um, it was absolute car crash. And I, she kind of blanked me as soon as I got there, even though she was telling them that she'd only do the shoot.

[00:45:24] If I was the hairdresser, it was like this, it was like this very weird power. It was control. I think. And whatever you need to label it. Uh huh. And I, and I got there and then she ignored me. And so all these production and that, like, oh, have you had an argument before you? I was like, I don't even know, babe. Like she just blanked me anyway. Then I did her hair and it was just chaos. And we're in this place and, um, we get the shoot done and she's like, oh, you're going to come home in the bus with me. And I was like, well, yeah. Okay.

[00:45:55] Long story short, I ended up living with her in Dubai for a number of weeks. And again, I keep saying this, I'm from a small seaside town. And all of a sudden I'm sleeping, sleeping, not, not anything else with Lindsay Lohan. It's like, even when I say that, that sounds absolutely fucking mental. And I, I saw a, a vulnerable person and I was also very vulnerable myself.

[00:46:21] And my mum is a recovering alcoholic and my housemate at the time was in full blown alcoholism. And I was also, I'd also functioning. So you've got this, I've got no safe space basically. And I didn't, I can say that in retrospect looking back, but I didn't know, but I kind of felt it. So I'd go from Lindsay's, I'd come back to London. I'd be with my alcoholic housemate. I'd probably get fucked up on meth. Then I'd go back to my home to recover a bit.

[00:46:50] I'd be with my alcoholic mum and back to, back to Dubai, back to Paris with Lindsay. Part of the vicious circle. It was, it was really crazy. But so I put up with a lot of things. We'll never get into bed with your artist. I mean, that was just bizarre. It sucks you in. It sucks you in and it takes you to a dark fucking place with some of these people. And you know, people are like, well, why would you do that? Well, it's like, you're in a house. She's like, oh, I can't sleep. Can you come and, can you come and just stroke my back?

[00:47:20] Like you stroke my hair. And I'm like, girl, you know that I, um, I'm back for the other team. Yeah. You, you know that. Yeah. But then look, I'm going to be really honest. It's like, yeah, what I, yeah. Was it right? Was it wrong? That's up for anyone to decide. But yeah, of course I do that. I stroked, uh, she went. Also like you kind of want to save people, but you need saving yourself and they don't need you to save them. But that kind of, that was my place.

[00:47:49] And I spent two years in a very toxic, not a work environment, by the way. I got paid a couple of times. And the one time where I could have got paid a decent check, we went to do San Laurent and she was sitting front row next to Anthony Vaccarello. And I can't remember, she, she could have booked me and that would have been like a two, two, three thousand pound fee that would have been paid by the brand. Great.

[00:48:14] She booked another hairdresser because he had more, well, he had Vogue covers and he had this. And I mean, so, so much that I can't really disclose, but we get to Paris, however we got to Paris. And, um, I basically had to watch a hairdresser do her hair really badly. She's got like a cow's lick here and like, you can't do anything. It just does its thing. So you work with it. And then the look he did was, and he put the bobby pins in down and up and they slid out.

[00:48:43] And I had, and I'm watching him do her hair and I was doing, she's like, oh, but you can do my brother's hair. Dakota, lovely, lovely guy. And, um, and you, and, and she'd sort of made a fuss that I was her manager and that I'm going to San Laurent. Right. So I'm getting dressed and they're going, but we don't dress managers. And she's like, no, but you need to dress him. Um, and I'm like, again, I'm going to say it again, small town boy in Paris. I'm about to go to San Laurent and there's been a buildup to this, by the way, there

[00:49:13] has been, it hasn't been, it was not lovely getting on the plane to Paris. It was not lovely going through the air. There was a lot. We could do a lot on this. I should write. Yeah. I mean, yeah, there was like, yeah, I remember the whole vodka and the water bottle trick. You know what I mean? It was like, it was insane and manipulation because I was, I was around a lot of that. And I heard the manipulation from her and it was everywhere you went, you know, she was

[00:49:43] just a car crash. Literally, literally like one of my friends, she like ran into his car right outside of Hyde. You know what I mean? And it was like, she's let go the gap, the break and just smash into his car. So how did you break yourself out of that cycle, Adam? In Paris. So she'd paid for my flight to Paris, but she wasn't paying me and I hadn't done the Saint Laurent show. And I'd said to her, like, I'm on Sam's McKnight's team and I'm staying in the bloody,

[00:50:12] the fanciest hotel and the residents downstairs having dinner and she's going over and it's like, it's nuts. Like the lifestyle that you could enter quite quickly, not even taking into consideration addiction, toxic home environment, all of the stuff going on. And it's like, it would be different if I was sat here. This is why I'm probably comfortable talking about it because if I was sat here as an employed

[00:50:35] person and I was knew what I was kind of doing, I probably wouldn't able to be as forthcoming and I'm probably being too forthcoming, but I don't really care. It was not okay how I was treated and I had my part in accepting that. And I said I was going to go and work with Sam and basically, I'll never forget, I've got the Saint Laurent jacket on and we're going to the unofficial after party. We've just left the after party where we've got Kate Moss, Cindy Crawford and your Rubik.

[00:51:05] There was an amazing stripper that came out of a champagne glass and it was fucking amazing. And we're at this party and then some person, this is what used to happen with Lindsay and I can see why she was so damaged and exploited. And it used to hurt me because it was never that, that was never, I've got one selfie with Lindsay Lohan in the two years. I took one picture with her. I was very, I had my integrity in that. And this one person said to her, oh, we can go to the better after party.

[00:51:33] And I'm like, babe, there is no better after party. Anyway, we're getting in the car and we're on our way to the better after party. And I said, oh, I'm going to probably leave a little bit earlier. And she just went nuts. You're with me. You're on my time. Andy Lecomte wouldn't ever do that. Andy Lecomte. And I'm like, and I really admire Andy and Andy's work. And I think he's working with Madonna a lot at the time. So again, I'm like inferior. I'm not good enough to be here.

[00:52:02] I'm not getting paid to do the Saint Laurent. And now she's telling me I'm not Andy Lecomte. And we're in that part of Paris where like all the cars go together. And there's like everywhere is a car. And the car stops. And I just said, I can't do this. I had a breakdown. I was like, I can't do this anymore. And I got out the car. And she's like, there's all the cars beeping. It's like out of a movie, right? And that's nuts. And the driver's going, get back in, get back in. And I'm like, no, no, no, I'm done.

[00:52:31] And she went, give me the jacket back. And I'm like, you're not keeping the jacket. And I'm like, I'm about to get fucking ran over. So I got back in the car, got to the party. She told the security not to let me in. She'd gone ahead. She was really nasty. When she flipped and she's an incredible person. And I really hope what we're seeing now is genuine. I don't know. I've not seen it, but I really hope that she has. I've sorted my shit out. So I know that anybody can do that at any point.

[00:52:58] And, but she was not a kind person at times. There was a very kind person. And then it would flip. And when it flipped, it got very dark. Like on a dime. I've seen it. You know what I mean? In Andy's house. You know what I mean? So I've been there. You know what I mean? So I know exactly what you're talking about. So yeah. I just had enough. And I said, and the publicist, who was a waste of space, some woman called Laura. I hope she sees this. She's like, you're never going to work in this industry.

[00:53:27] You don't know how unprofessional you are. And I'm like, babe, I'm working with all the supermodels at shows with Sam. I went to work the next day. Everyone, of course, everyone just assumes when you're with Lindsay Lohan, they assumed that you were on drugs all the time. And because they knew about my addiction, I wasn't even allowed to smoke cigarettes. If she didn't want me to smoke a cigarette, I wasn't drinking. I definitely didn't do drugs. We never did drugs. I never saw drugs. There was never drugs. Or illegal drugs that I'm aware of.

[00:53:57] And so I walk into Sam's show and everyone's like, Adam, are you okay? And I was having a breakdown and I was shaking. And it's one time that I put so much gel in the hair and Sam came in. What the fuck are you doing? I can't remember how he said it, but he was like, what the fuck are you doing? And I just was like losing it. And I went out and got some air and I could see the Eiffel Tower. And I was just like, someone came out. They were really good with me. And they're like, are you okay? And I was like, I can't do this. I don't know what's happening right now.

[00:54:25] But I was like, and I just said, no, I'm not going back in the publicist. And then they were like, right, well, you can't stay in the hotel. And I didn't have accommodations. She was like, oh, it was just such mess. And she then texts, Lindsay then texts me. I was like, we're going to Giuseppe Zanotti. This was the next day. We're going to Giuseppe Zanotti. We'll start doing hair at six. I was like, oh no. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Probably. Pretending nothing happened. Yeah. Pretending nothing happened, then nothing happens. Yeah. That's it. So, y'all?

[00:54:55] Did you go? No, no, no, no, no. I did the shows with Sam and I came home and I lay in bed and I genuinely was not well for two days. Dark thoughts, you know. I'll say suicidal thoughts. And I don't throw that out there. Just saying it lightly. It was a moment of like, and that's not just because of Lindsay. That's also because of my part and the environment. Everything. Everything. I had sort of a...

[00:55:25] And my recovery journey had really begun around that time. I mean, in the last five years of my addiction before 2024, I had a lapse a couple of times a year. So, I mean, I'm not saying that that means I was clean all that time, but I was beginning that journey. So, I had five years of very intermittent using, but of course I was a dry drunk or sort of... All the behaviours were still there. I wasn't well, but I wasn't using the substance.

[00:55:56] Yeah. There you go. Adam. What about... What about... Can I give you another one? Yeah. Yes. When I fucked up Rita Ora's hair. Ooh. That was a good one. So, I put Chris Appleton on a pedestal before he became the Chris Appleton as we know today. Because I really loved what he did with Rita Ora. They were doing the voice and he was doing... He cut her hair that one time, just really lobbed it off. So, I had Rita Ora and Chris Appleton as my idols.

[00:56:24] And then the option came in to work with Rita Ora. And I overcomplicated the fuck out of it. I was up all night prepping extensions. I was doing this, doing this, doing this. I get to her house and she'd just come... I think it was either a Met or something big and she was just coming back into the public eye. We were going to radio, right? All I needed to do was scrape it back into a bun. Job done. Yeah. But because I built up this thing about Chris Appleton and that I wanted to show off and I was... I was so not in it. I was so in it.

[00:56:54] I was not in it. And I took out her hair extensions and she had interesting hair to say the least. And I couldn't... I'll give you the images. You can insert them in here if that's what you do. I could not... I couldn't get the baby hairs right. I put too many extensions in. And hey, look, it didn't look like a car crash, but it didn't look like the level that she was used to. And it certainly wasn't something I was proud of. She went out the door. I was meant to do her two days in a row.

[00:57:22] And then I knew my agent at the time. I just knew what was coming. And she's like, yeah, what happened? Like she's dropped you from tomorrow. I spent two weeks wanting to like never do hair again. And I tell that because it's like it was really important to me at the time. It's really important to me now, but from a different lens, from the lens of growth. I read a book called Sumo, Shut Up and Move On. It's a red book with a sumo wrestler on the front. I read that and I got myself out of the hole.

[00:57:53] And I've gone on to work with some incredible celebrities. I've gone on to go on tour. I've done covers of magazines. I've had an amazing career. One thing also, I am not the best hairdresser. I wanted to be the best hairdresser. But what does being the best hairdresser actually mean? That statement is so flawed. So for a long time, all I did was pressurize myself to be the best or this amazing thing. Whilst actually just going, you're a hairdresser.

[00:58:23] You work with hair. You're all right. You're good. Be comfortable at that. And aspire to be a bit more. But needing to be the ultimate in anything is just, in my opinion, always going to flatten you. Yeah, absolutely. Well, Adam, it was amazing having you on the show. I, wow. Yeah, wow. What a journey this conversation was. It was, we covered so much. ...about the hair history and everything like that.

[00:58:51] I would really love a conversation ongoing with you. Thank you. We're definitely going to do it again. That's for sure. You know what I mean? Because there's so much that we need to cover with you that with this episode didn't even like, even barely even touch it. We just scratched the surface. I'd really love to help inspire the next generation. And I think just if you, if we've got time now just to finish off, it's really important to know why you want to do anything you're doing.

[00:59:20] And that doesn't need to be that you've got the end goal in place, but you need to know why. I think I saw a lot of people trying to do session or trying to do editorial hair as a day out or to get out of the salon and try something. It's business. There are people that have been there a long time and established their careers. You can't come in and just try. You've got to find a way in. There isn't a one, two, three, here we can get you in. It will be individual for every person. It will be individual based on where you live,

[00:59:50] what kind of work you're currently doing, how you position yourself on your Instagram. You could have half a million followers doing big bouncy blow dries and be the best at that and probably famous within your right. I'm not going to book you based on that. I'm probably not going to book you. I'm probably going to book the 23 year old that comes to me and says, I know who Sassoon is. I know who Patti LaBelle is. And I'm really passionate, but I've got no experience. I'm going to grab him. I'm going to say yes. So there is so much that I'd love to talk to you about, about helping that next generation understand

[01:00:20] why are you going to try and enter the fashion industry? What is it that's pulling you there? And the other thing that a lot of people, especially here in the UK, don't like talking about, what money investment are you going to put into it? Because it isn't, you don't get paid straight away. You're going to lose money. You're going to invest into it. And you need to be aware of what you're signing yourself up for and have a picture of what the potential gain is. And I've got so much more I could say on this. It's like there are limited spots within session

[01:00:48] and they're getting smaller with the rise of AI, different ways that productions are working. Those jobs are getting smaller within the lookbooks, the e-commerce. It's shrinking. And my belief, that will continue to happen. So if those jobs are already shrinking, you're trying to come in and there's already these people below the Guidos and the Sams and even below the Anthony's and the Cyndia Harvey's and Jawaawa. You've got this other bunch of people that have done their time and rightly deserve that shot at those jobs.

[01:01:18] What is it you're going to get here? How are you going to do it? And I'm not saying, if you really believe you want to be a session hairstylist and you want to work in fashion, do it. You can absolutely achieve anything you want. But it's not easy. And I don't believe it's going to be easy. But I can help you navigate that path. I cannot guarantee that you will get there. I can't guarantee anything.

[01:01:46] But I can help you maybe speed some of the things up and give you that confidence, that advice, how to send an email, how to communicate, and how to build your hair archive or your industry archive. Because if you go in a room and you can reference a hairstyle that Cher had at the Oscars in 1987, if that ever comes up or whatever comes up and you go, oh yeah, and you can get that image and you know something, you feel something,

[01:02:15] you just, you're going to, you're going to be in it. That's how you're going to get in it these days. That's my belief anymore. But we can talk all night about that. Oh, absolutely. Well, I'm going to put your information in the show notes. You know what I mean? So that way, guys, if you want to reach out, follow Adam on Instagram. I'm going to go through and tag him on all kinds of stuff. Please go through and look at all of his work and please listen. Just sit and listen for like an afternoon and just watch all of this stuff.

[01:02:44] You're going to learn, you're going to grow and let Adam just kind of be your guide through something like this. So Adam, thank you so much for coming on. I really appreciate it. Thanks for the knowledge. And I'm going to be still blowing you up. So you haven't seen the last of me. That's for fucking sure. You've been really, really kind. And I'm so grateful to be here and to be able to do this with where I've got to. And I'm really grateful that you've given me that opportunity. So thank you, Paula. Thanks for coming and being on.

[01:03:14] An honor. Absolutely. Thanks. All right. Okay. All right. Let's get into it. Some shitology. So, hey, Jason, how is it living the glamorous life with all the movie stars and on the jets and everything? I mean, what do you get to experience? And are you missing out on anything? Are you fucking kidding me? I'm missing out on shit. I mean, we're on private planes. We're at these best fucking restaurants.

[01:03:43] I mean, shit is amazing. I mean, fuck that. I miss like, you know, a wedding or like my dad died. Oh, well, I mean, shit. Look what I'm fucking doing. Kind of amazing. Yeah. So my niece was born. So what? You know what I mean? I'll catch up when I'm done. Sounds absolutely amazing. It's great. And with that, stay shitty. And see you next time. Hey, listener persons.

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